The Cheat Sheet: Fiends and Fireworks

[00:00:00] [SPEAKER_01] Hi everybody, I'm Anya Kane. Today on The Cheat Sheet we're going to be discussing some cases from Indiana, California. I think we're going to Canada, our neighbor to the north, as well as, where's your last one Kevin? Kevin Greenlee My last one is from Alabama. Kevin Greenlee Oh, you've been doing a lot of Alabama cases lately. All right, let's do it. Kevin Greenlee Oh, content warning. Kevin Greenlee Yeah, do that. Kevin Greenlee Content Warning. This episode contains discussion of murder and violence, as well as the

[00:00:29] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin Greenlee The Brutal Murder of Two Young Children. Kevin Greenlee So we are recording this all the way back in the distant past of June 18th, because for some reason we thought, well, let's see if we can record three of these in a day. Kevin Greenlee Not for some reason. Let's give them an honest answer. The answer is because we want to have more time to work on long term projects and getting some things done ahead of time is a good way of doing that. Kevin Greenlee But if we can do three in a day, and it turns out okay, and we don't seem crazy or outrageous,

[00:01:00] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin Greenlee Couldn't we do three cheat sheets a day, five days a week, and start putting out 15 cheat sheets a week? That's a flawless plan, right? Because isn't that what we're proving? I notice you're not saying anything. Kevin O'Connor There's nothing to say. Kevin O'Connor And also, well, let's see how this goes. I think that's a great plan. We also have great premium over on Patreon and Apple. We get extra episodes, early episodes, ad-free episodes.

[00:01:28] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor That's right.

[00:01:30] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin O'Connor That's right. Kevin O'Connor That's a great deal. We have a lot of fun. We'd love to see you there. Also, it's like 4th of July weekend, so be careful out there. I think Anya is going to get out her big Uncle Sam hat, get out her stilts, and do her big 4th of July routine this week.

[00:01:48] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor What does my big 4th of July routine entail?

[00:01:52] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin O'Connor You wear your Uncle Sam pants. You get your big oversized Uncle Sam. Kevin O'Connor Hat. Kevin O'Connor And then you start walking around with sparklers in your hands, twirling them around, offering good wishes and good cheer to delighted onlookers.

[00:02:12] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor My only sparkler memories are, I remember over the summer once having a sparkler. I think I was like 5, and I remember there were a lot of tears because I burned my hand on it, and I was very sad. Kevin O'Connor I guess we're on the eve of the 250th birthday of the United States of America, so we're about to the semi-quincentennial. Is that what they're saying?

[00:02:37] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin O'Connor Yeah, and you were sharing with me some of your memories from the bicentennial.

[00:02:40] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor Which I wasn't alive for.

[00:02:42] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin O'Connor No. I was the one that was alive then.

[00:02:44] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor What was young Kevin out doing?

[00:02:47] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin O'Connor I was like reading comic books, watching TV.

[00:02:51] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor So you weren't actually celebrating your nation's birth?

[00:02:55] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin O'Connor There were comic books to be read, TV shows to be watched. I remember, you know, I grew up in Columbus, Indiana, which you always say is the Athens of the prairies. And I remember for some reason all the fire hydrants, all the mini fire hydrants that we have throughout our great city of Columbus, Indiana for safety purposes.

[00:03:19] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor I was like, you know, I'm glad you're not. I'm glad you put the money into the Uncle Sam suit and the hat.

[00:03:46] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor I'm not going to wear an Uncle Sam suit and frankly, like, shut up. Like, you're just you're just singing inane stuff all day. I've let it slide for the past three or so cheat sheets and you're done. You're done. You're absolutely done.

[00:04:01] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin O'Connor So you see, folks, at the end of three cheat sheets, tempers start to flare. The system starts breaking down.

[00:04:09] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor You always describe me in the most unflattering terms. Who wants to hear about you talking about me wearing an Uncle Sam suit? Kevin O'Connor Like, also, what woman wants their husband to picture them as Uncle Sam? What is wrong with you?

[00:04:25] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin O'Connor I think women who love their country, who love patronism, who have pride in their country.

[00:04:32] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor No, why don't you, you know what? Like, it's gonna be some conversations. Kevin O'Connor I love also, no one can see this, but Nora's sitting really placidly right behind Kevin, just looking like an Arctic fox. Kevin O'Connor Meanwhile, when I yelled, Nick jumped off the couch ready to spring into action. Kevin O'Connor Ha ha ha. All right, are we done with this inane banter?

[00:04:57] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin O'Connor I think it's time to start hearing about cases.

[00:05:00] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor Let's do it. Kevin O'Connor My name is Anya Kane. I'm a journalist.

[00:05:04] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin O'Connor And I'm Kevin Greenlee. I'm an attorney. Kevin O'Connor And this is The Murder Sheet. Kevin O'Connor We're a true crime podcast focused on original reporting, interviews, and deep dives into murder cases. We're The Murder Sheet.

[00:05:16] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor And this is The Cheat Sheet, Fiends and Fireworks.

[00:06:05] [SPEAKER_00] Kevin O'Connor Anya, take it away.

[00:06:06] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor All right. I think I'm going, I'm up at bat. So, my first case is in Indiana, and my source for this is the Indiana Lawyer, and I also did some digging on my case, as well as newspapers.com, which is a wonderful resource for any of you folks who are interested in researching older crimes. Kevin O'Connor The Media used to be better. Kevin O'Connor Like, just going to be blunt about it.

[00:06:31] [SPEAKER_01] Kevin O'Connor You used to get a lot of information from your local newspaper, even as recently as 10 years ago, that just does not exist now. Kevin O'Connor And, you know, we've lost a lot. Kevin O'Connor But you can go back and look at old cases that way. Evansville Courier and Press was very helpful for me for this one, and that was accessed through newspapers.com, a great resource. Kevin O'Connor So, this is a horrible, horrible case. One of those ones that kind of defies any real understanding.

[00:07:00] [SPEAKER_01] You're not going to find a motive, at least. Not what I, I didn't find one. I didn't find one. It's possible it's in the record, and I just missed it, or it's possible. I'm not saying I did the deepest dive in the world here. This is a cheat sheet. We're kind of giving you the capsulation of the whole thing, but I don't know why this happened. And no explanation would really make it make sense, though.

[00:07:22] [SPEAKER_01] So on April 10th, 2010, in Evansville, Indiana, a man named Jeffrey Weishite was watching his fiance's two children, five-year-old Caleb and eight-year-old Alyssa Lynch. So the Lynch children, and this is in Vanderburg County.

[00:07:48] [SPEAKER_01] And for whatever, I mean, he brutally killed them. He hogtied Caleb, a five-year-old boy, put railroad flares in his underwear and ignited them and then fled the house. The house burned down, killing Caleb and Alyssa, who was also in the house. He was then chased down by law enforcement, and there was a high-speed chase. He went to Kentucky, and he threw a knife at responding officers.

[00:08:17] [SPEAKER_01] They tased him, I believe, and they took him into custody. And he was ultimately convicted by a jury on two counts of murder, and they gave him a death sentence because there were so many aggravating circumstances to this. And also, I mean, one notable thing is that Alyssa was eight, Caleb was five. They were both under 12. That's yet another aggravating circumstance.

[00:08:43] [SPEAKER_01] So he's been asking for post-conviction relief. That was denied. The Supreme Court of Indiana affirmed that decision. He went to federal court. They filed habeas corpus petitions in the United States District Court for the Southern District of Indiana. That was denied in 2022. The United States Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit affirmed the decision.

[00:09:07] [SPEAKER_01] And most recently, on June 8, 2026, the United States Supreme Court declined to hear the case. Kevin, as an attorney, what does that mean? Does the U.S. Supreme Court hear every case they get asked to hear?

[00:09:23] [SPEAKER_00] No, absolutely not. Yeah, the Supreme Court, they are in the enviable position of getting to choose their own workload. You can ask for your case to be heard by the Supreme Court. And then it's up to the justices themselves to decide whether or not to hear it. If they think a case poses an interesting question or if they think it raises an issue that needs to be clarified,

[00:09:51] [SPEAKER_00] they will vote to hear it and grant that's called granting a associary.

[00:09:56] [SPEAKER_01] So it's almost like usually and correct me if I'm wrong, usually at the very least, it has to ask an interesting legal question and can't just be like you're run of the mill. There's nothing surprising here.

[00:10:08] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, generally.

[00:10:09] [SPEAKER_01] Generally. OK.

[00:10:10] [SPEAKER_00] It has to usually involve a conflict between like two different states. It has to involve a federal question of law.

[00:10:16] [SPEAKER_01] So now that it's been rejected by the United States Supreme Court, Indiana Attorney General Todd Rekita has asked the Indiana Supreme Court to schedule Weiss Heights execution. And I believe there's maybe four other men on death row in Indiana, but they are looking to execute this man. Some complications of this, you know, the way people are executed in Indiana, we need pentobarbital.

[00:10:44] [SPEAKER_01] That's a drug that has been used in the last round of lethal injections here. But it can be very difficult to get that. So it's not even clear if they have the means to execute him, but they are asking for it to be scheduled. And if the Supreme Court goes for it, he will be executed in Michigan City at the Indiana State Prison. I just want to note something because, again, I was so troubled by the lack of motive here.

[00:11:12] [SPEAKER_01] And I figured I would note something. It seems like this individual was engaged to the children's mother, but was not related to them. And I think it is worth noting that there is a lot of research out there that points to when you have young, young children living in a household with unrelated adults.

[00:11:42] [SPEAKER_01] Adults who are not biologically kin to them. They are, like, far more likely to die by an inflicted injury. When the person is a male caregiver, especially, like, a male caregiver who is dating the mom, that is, you know, these are risky things as far as child abuse go, and unfortunately in this case, fatal child murder.

[00:12:09] [SPEAKER_01] That's not to say at all that it's, like, basically what they look at with the data is, like, the risk is not actually with having a single parent home. That's not the risk. The risk is bringing basically unrelated males into the household. That's not to say that no one should be able to date as a single parent or as a single mother. And because most unrelated adults would never do something like this.

[00:12:34] [SPEAKER_01] And you can certainly find a very nice person to become a husband and a stepfather to children who's going to be a wonderful addition to their life. I'm sure a lot of people we can talk to have wonderful step parents who were great. It's not to say that, oh, don't do this because this will happen. It's more to say that when you are integrating an unrelated adult into the household, just be paying very attention to how the children are treated,

[00:13:03] [SPEAKER_01] because that is a risk factor and that can go wrong. And it's men in particular. I mean, like, again, not all men, but when they were looking at cases of fatal maltreatment, what I saw was that in one study when they were looking at that, like a very high percentage of the perpetrators were not related to the victims. And 94% of those unrelated perpetrators were men.

[00:13:31] [SPEAKER_01] So no shade to all the stepfathers and the fathers who stepped up and the great, you know, men who were an addition to kids' lives and got along great and everything went well. But it is to say, I just think people should be very careful and very cognizant of the numbers and of the risk factors so that they can make a very informed choice about who they bring around their children. That's all I'll say.

[00:13:57] [SPEAKER_00] That's a great point. Well said.

[00:14:00] [SPEAKER_01] Now, am I going, no, we're going to end, we're going to do a sandwich, right? Because I'm going to end on my fireworks case.

[00:14:07] [SPEAKER_00] Spoiler alert.

[00:14:08] [SPEAKER_01] Oh, sorry.

[00:14:09] [SPEAKER_00] So I'm going to be, I guess, the filling in the Anya sandwich.

[00:14:14] [SPEAKER_01] No, this sounds weird. It's getting weird. Let's just move on.

[00:14:17] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah. We should. Third cheat sheet of the day. So, yeah, you got to cut us some slack. Standards are slipping.

[00:14:26] [SPEAKER_01] Don't say that.

[00:14:29] [SPEAKER_00] Okay.

[00:14:30] [SPEAKER_01] Standards are fine. Let's just move on.

[00:14:33] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, there was nothing wrong with that sandwich remark at all. That was top flight stuff. I'm not embarrassed or ashamed of that. So let's go to an awful, awful case out of Ontario, Canada. This summer, you need comfortable go anywhere pieces that are made with quality and care and affordability in mind. You need our wonderful sponsor, Quince.

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[00:16:24] [SPEAKER_00] And the source for this is the National Post. It's another one of these cases that seems like there wasn't a real motive. This involves the death of an 83-year-old woman named Eleanor Doney. She was killed by a 14-year-old boy who is not being named publicly.

[00:16:49] [SPEAKER_00] Basically, she was just outside in her front lawn doing some gardening. A boy walks by, talks to her for a couple of minutes, and then viciously stabs her to death. And she died, I think, like an hour after this attack occurred.

[00:17:12] [SPEAKER_00] When police investigated, they learned that this 14-year-old child was very, very online. And if people had been paying attention to his online activities, there certainly was a lot of indications there that things were going in an awful direction.

[00:17:38] [SPEAKER_00] He was on Discord, and his chats there showed that he was very, very interested in killing and murderers. He was also interested in a character out of a Japanese comic book, Yashikage Kira.

[00:18:02] [SPEAKER_00] This is a character who is a murderer, who tries to go through life without being exposed as a murderer, and who stalks and murders women. This boy was very interested in this character to the extent that he would copy some of the language this character used.

[00:18:29] [SPEAKER_00] He also dressed in a way that kind of copied the clothes this character wrote. He looked at his hand a lot, too, and apparently this character that I'm not familiar with also has a hand fetish. He wrote a lot online, this boy, about getting away with murder and how he could get away with it, unlike the historical serial killers.

[00:19:00] [SPEAKER_00] He's very interested online with sociopathy, psychopathy. He is watching and consuming media about serial killers, about stabbing people, about how to get away with murder. He watched a video online about how to stab a person most effectively.

[00:19:26] [SPEAKER_00] He did online searches, again, for things like how serial killers got away. He watched a four-hour YouTube video on the most sadistic serial killers in history. He's very interested in Ted Bundy. So these are the things that fill his mind.

[00:19:46] [SPEAKER_00] He looks up the bus schedule and he hops on the bus and he goes out walking in this neighborhood where he encounters this woman he killed. After he kills her, he goes back online and he's consuming a typical YouTube diet. He's watching clips from Family Guy, clips from Breaking Bad.

[00:20:12] [SPEAKER_00] And then he is still watching YouTube until just about a half hour before police finally arrest him. And so what's disturbing about this is, I don't know if this is a case where he was like radicalized or changed by what he saw online.

[00:20:32] [SPEAKER_00] But it seems clear that at the very least, the online world gave him a platform and it gave him a venue with which to explore some disturbing interests and that he explored them in a very unhealthy way.

[00:20:51] [SPEAKER_00] And if people had been paying attention and if people had been keeping a good eye on him, I feel it is entirely possible that steps could have been taken to help him, to help steer him in a different direction. And perhaps this woman would still be alive today. What do you think about all this?

[00:21:14] [SPEAKER_01] Yeah, I mean, judging from the, like, I'm of the opinion, like, kids can definitely hide stuff from their parents and guardians. I mean, right? Isn't that kind of being a teenager? I'm not, I don't consider myself, like, if someone's like, oh, my kid developed a drug problem and I didn't realize until it was too late. Like, I can understand that. I think it's pretty, you know, but the dress here, the obsession with, like, a very violent character. Character. I'm not familiar with that property either. You know, like, that level.

[00:21:44] [SPEAKER_01] I mean, all of that's enough. I think, like, your parents, I mean, whatever, I don't know what his living situation was, but his parents or guardians had to be aware that he was a creepy little guy. You know, I mean, like, just flaunting around in that outfit. It just, I don't know.

[00:21:58] [SPEAKER_00] It's not like he's having conversations online about how he can kill and get away with.

[00:22:02] [SPEAKER_01] Well, you know, maybe they don't know Discord, but, like, the way he's dressed, I mean, he looks like.

[00:22:06] [SPEAKER_00] I mean, the people he's talking with, they should have known.

[00:22:08] [SPEAKER_01] Well, they should have. Well, yeah, they certainly should have. I mean, but, again, like, if those are other kids, then I'm just saying the parents have the most, you know, direct ability to do something about this. And, again, if your kid's going through a phase where they're obsessed with, like, I don't know, something violent, I don't necessarily know that that is going to make them a killer. But certainly maybe having a talk with them and ensuring that they don't have a bunch of misogynistic, creepy attitudes about everything and, you know, like, see life as a game where they're going to be the killer.

[00:22:36] [SPEAKER_01] You know, I think that's where you maybe probe a little bit deeper and you get a little bit more involved. And if you're seeing concerning signs, then you keep going. And it's just, you know, I don't know. People need to, like, I just, like, if people just, it's not really parenting to just, like, let your kid on the internet and let them consume and do whatever and take no responsibility for that.

[00:22:59] [SPEAKER_01] And you're just doing your kid a disservice because if they do something like this, then, you know, hopefully they go away for a while.

[00:23:07] [SPEAKER_00] Well, I'm also, as I say, I think I'm interested in the people he was having these conversations with. And if you're having conversations online with somebody and you see them start doing some concerning things, you should say or do something about it. You should take it seriously.

[00:23:25] [SPEAKER_01] You have a responsibility to say or do something about it, you know? And I don't understand how anyone in that situation could turn the other way and not do anything about it. And frankly, yeah, it disgusts me, the lack of taking accountability here.

[00:23:45] [SPEAKER_00] Let's move on to a case out of Alabama. Alabama, my source for this, is the Justice Department and Fox 10 TV. Alabama has a great football program, have nothing but good things to say about Alabama and offer them plenty of encouragement in the future. What a great program.

[00:24:09] [SPEAKER_01] They really are. But we support IU in this household.

[00:24:13] [SPEAKER_00] But you've made clear, no taunting.

[00:24:15] [SPEAKER_01] Because I don't want to taunt anybody doesn't mean that I'm not supporting IU.

[00:24:20] [SPEAKER_00] We wish them nothing but success as they continue unfettered up towards their ultimate destiny.

[00:24:29] [SPEAKER_01] Just say what you're going to say.

[00:24:33] [SPEAKER_00] We talk on the show a lot about police officers, obviously. And police officers are in a unique position. Because if they do something incorrectly, if they make mistakes, if they do something, God forbid, that's corrupt or wrong, it has a ripple effect.

[00:24:58] [SPEAKER_00] Because if a person is wrong or corrupt once, it raises questions about other cases they're involved in. And it really has a lot more impact than what might even be, if first, most readily apparent. And I'm talking today about a police officer with the Pritchard Police Department in Alabama, Emmanuel Dodge.

[00:25:25] [SPEAKER_00] He has been arrested and charged with multiple criminal counts. I'm quoting from this press release from the U.S. Attorney's Office, including civil rights violations, conspiracy, taking bribes, tampering with evidence and extortion. The criminal complaint alleges that Dodge covered up crimes and concealed evidence for violent individuals to assist them in avoiding prosecution.

[00:25:51] [SPEAKER_00] The complaint affidavit further alleges that Dodge conspired with other PPD officers to conduct unlawful traffic stops and detentions of victims to deprive them of rights secured by the Constitution and laws of the United States.

[00:26:08] [SPEAKER_00] Finally, the charges alleged that Dodge extorted individuals for bribes in exchange for letting them go free from arrest and agreed to accept corrupt payments to commit illegal acts, including transporting bulk marijuana, all while acting under the color of law as a police officer. This is horrifying stuff. But for me, it got even worse when I heard about the family of a man named Cornelius Cunningham.

[00:26:35] [SPEAKER_00] Mr. Cunningham was killed all the way back in February 27th, 2018. And the person in charge of investigating that case is none other than Mr. Dodge.

[00:26:52] [SPEAKER_00] A family member, Kenetra Cunningham, now says she has to wonder if perhaps his investigation of that crime was also somehow affected by his corruption. And that's a crime in which no one has been arrested or no one's been charged. You know, she has to wonder, did he accept some sort of payoff? He let someone get free in that case.

[00:27:19] [SPEAKER_01] Yeah.

[00:27:20] [SPEAKER_00] There's no evidence that he did, but it raises the question and it causes a lot of torment for innocent people in a horrible situation.

[00:27:31] [SPEAKER_01] Well said. Yeah. It's like once you've proven, I mean, that's why it's so bad when police officers behave in this way or do illegal things or do anything remotely sketchy, frankly, because the ripple effects, as you said. And it's like these people, it's going to haunt them. I mean, like their case, their loved one not getting justice and would it have been different had it gone to a different officer. It's just it's very troublesome.

[00:28:00] [SPEAKER_01] It can also taint an entire department, right? It's like you hired this guy. You had him operating in your midst. How did you not catch this? It's just when you have police officers behave in an unethical or corrupt way. Or bigoted or anything, like kind of throw in any negative thing. It undermines everyone's trust in law enforcement. And I think that has a really detrimental effect on society. But it's unavoidable because how can you trust when there's no basis for trust when people are behaving this way?

[00:28:31] [SPEAKER_00] Exactly.

[00:28:32] [SPEAKER_01] I'm glad they caught him, but it's like the damage is done. And I would hope there would be extensive efforts from the agencies he was involved in and his colleagues there to regain trust and establish that here's what we're going to be doing to ensure that this can't happen again. And here's what we're doing to ensure that the rot is fully gone.

[00:29:01] [SPEAKER_00] So, Anya, do you want to now move on to your much Ballyhooed fireworks case?

[00:29:06] [SPEAKER_01] Yeah. Ballyhooed is a fun word. My case is in California. And this was a pretty horrifying situation that happened out of Esparto, California. Esparto is in Yolo County. And it's what happened was it was July 1st, 2025.

[00:29:34] [SPEAKER_01] And a fireworks warehouse caught fire in Esparto. Obviously, that's a very bad place to have a fire because there's fireworks everywhere. There were a number of explosions and ultimately a massive blast. So, there were seven victims who were working there, I believe. And I'm going to read their names because I think it's always important to reflect on the names of the dead. And these are the people whose lives were lost in this horrible situation.

[00:30:03] [SPEAKER_01] 18-year-old Angel Matthew Voller, Carlos Javier Rodriguez Mora, who's 43, Neil Justin Lee, 41, Joel Jeremias Melendez, 28, Christopher Galchow Bocock, 45, Jesus Manassez Ramos, 18, and Honi Ernesto Ramos, 22. So, they were all killed. Horrible explosion.

[00:30:32] [SPEAKER_01] And also, it started a fire. It started the Oakdale Fire. And that was ultimately contained on July 6th. So, they immediately begin investigating this fireworks concern. And ultimately, they find a lot of really troubling things. One thing is that the warehouse was associated with a company called Devastating Pyrotechnics. The owner and CEO of that was a man named Kenneth Chee.

[00:31:00] [SPEAKER_01] Now, he was operating this business despite having been denied a license by the ATF, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives, to even own explosives. So, they denied him that permit. And that was because he had been convicted in 1998 of assault with a firearm and firing a gun from a vehicle. And basically, if you do something like that, if it's like a certain type of crime, they will just not give you a federal explosives license.

[00:31:30] [SPEAKER_01] And yet, somehow, while the ATF said no, the state fire marshal said yes when he asked to be able to trade, sell, and launch fireworks. So, he was like, I don't know how that happens. But the federal government said no. Apparently, California said yes. And they were also permitted to store fireworks in storage containers that were 2,000 feet away from the site of the explosion.

[00:31:58] [SPEAKER_01] So, you're already kind of hearing some things of like, okay, this is kind of concerning. This is sketchy. Obviously, accidents and tragedies can happen. But in instances where people are running extremely unsafe workplaces and disaster strikes, there can be more significant legal culpability there. And also, you find out that apparently, this guy had a Yolo County sheriff's lieutenant working for him, storing a million pounds of explosive on his property.

[00:32:26] [SPEAKER_01] And apparently, using or is alleged to have used his position with the sheriff's office to sort of like kind of shield this operation. So, April 10th, 2026, eight people were arrested and charged. A number of them were charged with murder as well, including she. And so, that is kind of where they are. Right now, the Yolo County District Attorney is asking a judge to basically put down a gag order in this case.

[00:32:56] [SPEAKER_01] That's why it's in the news right now. Or it was in the news. And my source for this, by the way, was the Sacramento Bee. They had an article on this gag order business. They're basically saying, we don't want the attorneys of record to be, and prospective witnesses to be commenting on this. There had been some of that going on in the press. And, you know, they basically, they're basically asking for this.

[00:33:24] [SPEAKER_01] So, not sure what's going to happen, but it does show you that, you know, murder, often we think of it as like, oh, I want somebody to die and I'm going to go kill them. But there can be murder charges in cases like this where there are concerns about the operation someone was running and how safe it was. And we'll have to see what happens in terms of the trials to see what sort of outcome takes place here. But certainly very concerning allegations out of California.

[00:33:50] [SPEAKER_00] Absolutely.

[00:33:52] [SPEAKER_01] All right. How are you doing?

[00:33:55] [SPEAKER_00] I think this is the fifth anniversary of our return from our honeymoon.

[00:34:00] [SPEAKER_01] Oh, wow. You're really tracking everything, aren't you?

[00:34:02] [SPEAKER_00] I am.

[00:34:03] [SPEAKER_01] Well, uh-huh.

[00:34:05] [SPEAKER_00] I remember, have we talked about fireworks on the show? Do you like fireworks?

[00:34:09] [SPEAKER_01] So, I grew up in New York and I didn't grow up in a fireworks family. It was all girls. I just remember reading a book about a little girl who turned into a ghost because the fireworks exploded in her hands and she lost her hands. And then she's a ghost and she's haunting people. And I remember being like, oh, pass on that. I don't want to deal with that.

[00:34:35] [SPEAKER_00] See, to me, that would just be like a challenge. I remember when I grew up, Indiana had some, frankly, ridiculous law where there's like out-of-state fireworks, which was code for the really cool fireworks. But you could only buy those if you signed a piece of paper saying, well, I'm buying these in Indiana, but I'll set them off in another state. No one took that seriously. We all went and we bought the out-of-state fireworks and set them off in Indiana.

[00:35:01] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, sure, sometimes they exploded in our faces and once I lost hearing for a day or so. But, you know, isn't it worth it?

[00:35:10] [SPEAKER_01] Didn't you almost shoot off fireworks in your face once? Wasn't that a story I've heard?

[00:35:14] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, this is the one where I lost hearing for a day or so.

[00:35:16] [SPEAKER_01] Why don't you explain what happened to the listener so maybe they can learn, be safe, be careful as you're doing stuff tomorrow.

[00:35:23] [SPEAKER_00] Well, you know, my dad is a firefighter, so I'm well aware of...

[00:35:27] [SPEAKER_01] So he was just standing there shaking his head in abject disappointment throughout this.

[00:35:32] [SPEAKER_00] No, it wasn't my fault. We were setting off fireworks and we set them off on a metal table. And one of the fireworks I set off was somehow defective. In which case, what I mean by that is when I lit it, which I lit it properly in very respectful, safe fashion.

[00:36:00] [SPEAKER_01] Of course.

[00:36:00] [SPEAKER_00] The second I lit it, it immediately goes off and goes off with great force. With a loud boom, as I say, made it difficult to hear for a couple of days. But I was very lucky because also it was defective in such a way that it was supposed to go up into the air. But for some reason, it went down.

[00:36:25] [SPEAKER_00] And the metal table it was on got really pretty badly mangled and destroyed, completely unusable. So if that had gone up in my face instead of going down, if it had gone up as it was supposed to, I probably would have been injured.

[00:36:45] [SPEAKER_01] Or killed.

[00:36:46] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah. But wasn't it worth it? No. Because I got to see some pretty cool fireworks.

[00:36:52] [SPEAKER_01] Folks, be very careful with fireworks. I don't have any safety tips to give because I've never shot off fireworks because that's just not what I'm about in my life. You're a bit of a coward. No, I just I feel like there's something a bit like, what are we doing? And frankly, listen, I love you, Indiana. I know I'm going to sound like the biggest buzzkill in the world here. But, you know, when we there was a place where we lived in Indiana for a while where it was just it sounded like a battlefield outside.

[00:37:18] [SPEAKER_01] And our dog would just freak out all night on the 4th of July. And it was like, we're is this not overdoing it a little bit? Like, come on. Like, I do. If you want to shoot up fireworks, fine. But why why is why? Like, why does it look like we've been invaded? Why is my dog she's having a panic attack? This was poor Lanny. I don't I don't know. I don't know how these guys will do with fireworks. They don't really seem to care about thunder. So maybe they're more patriotic dogs than Lanny was.

[00:37:48] [SPEAKER_01] But, you know, I just that was just a lot. It was a lot to go from like very not like they used to set off fireworks at like like a business, I think, near me when I was growing up. But like, you know, I don't know. There were fireworks, but they just seemed more distant, not like, oh, right outside my house. It was more of like, oh, we can go to the park and look at the fireworks in the distance or like kind of look across there. And then you'll see them setting it off in this town center. But but around Indiana, it was just like, oh, my God, dog.

[00:38:19] [SPEAKER_00] Well, we would do that fireworks.

[00:38:21] [SPEAKER_01] I like them.

[00:38:21] [SPEAKER_00] Yeah, we would do that here, too. But also, you know, here in the Midwest, people are taking it in their own hands. Yeah.

[00:38:27] [SPEAKER_01] And in their faces, apparently, at least in your case, are their metal tables.

[00:38:30] [SPEAKER_00] Oh, I'm fine. And I got to see a cool firework for a couple of days. I didn't have to hear as much as I'm usually bothered with hearing. And I was able to dispose of a metal table.

[00:38:42] [SPEAKER_01] What a wonderful outcome.

[00:38:44] [SPEAKER_00] So no lasting injuries. No, just just a lot of fun and merriment.

[00:38:49] [SPEAKER_01] Barely an issue.

[00:38:50] [SPEAKER_00] All in honor of our great country.

[00:38:51] [SPEAKER_01] Are you going to try to do fireworks this year?

[00:38:55] [SPEAKER_00] I have not gotten any fireworks yet. Maybe.

[00:38:59] [SPEAKER_01] Are you going to? Yeah, I just I'm honestly I'm a little concerned based on your history.

[00:39:06] [SPEAKER_00] I was surprised as we were walking around with our dogs the other day. I saw in our neighborhood a sign that somebody had done the the saddest, most pathetic, just embarrassing 4th of July. I'm not going to call it a firework thing. This is have you ever seen this? The snakes.

[00:39:32] [SPEAKER_01] The snakes.

[00:39:34] [SPEAKER_00] It's like a black, thick black tablet that you like put on the ground and you light it. And then it becomes like it expands and becomes like a column of black ash, which you are asked to believe. Oh, this is a snake growing. It's just ash in the shape of a column.

[00:39:59] [SPEAKER_01] Why are you trying to beef with our neighbors and anyone, any of the snake people?

[00:40:03] [SPEAKER_00] And then it leaves a black mark on your driveway that lasts for years in some cases.

[00:40:11] [SPEAKER_01] My goodness. That lasts for years?

[00:40:14] [SPEAKER_00] Yes.

[00:40:15] [SPEAKER_01] Mark of the snake. That sounds like a thriller.

[00:40:16] [SPEAKER_00] When I moved out of my childhood home and my parents did, there were still places on the driveway where you can see where I sadly lit a snake. That sounds like a euphemism.

[00:40:29] [SPEAKER_01] It really does. And so you're basically damaging your house's resale value? Or maybe people don't care what their driveways look like. I don't know. But I don't know. That just, I mean, honestly, it's all very foreign to me. I'm not going to lie. And I feel like, I mean, we have a couple of European listeners. Do you guys do fireworks in Europe? Is this just an American thing? I don't even know. I kind of assume it is. But to me, you know, I mean, if you were going to be actually seriously careful about it, I would be okay with it.

[00:40:58] [SPEAKER_01] But I would need your commitment not to be doing any buffoonery.

[00:41:02] [SPEAKER_00] I don't even know the meaning of the word buffoonery.

[00:41:04] [SPEAKER_01] You don't know anything about buffoonery? You don't, that doesn't sound familiar to you at all? Well, here's a note. Since we're getting into July, we have a cool event coming up for all you folks in Ohio, the Buckeyes State. Sunday, July 12th, 2026 in Columbus, Ohio, we will be appearing at the Columbus Book Festival. And again, this is Columbus, Ohio. Don't go to Indiana. I mean, you can. It's a lovely city, Columbus, Indiana.

[00:41:34] [SPEAKER_01] But that's not where we'll be. We're going to be going to Columbus, Ohio. And first of all, at noon on that day on Sunday, July 12th, we'll be moderating a panel of authors on Midwest murders at the festival. 3 p.m., we'll be doing author speed matching and we'll be having a blast. And it's going to be fun. I hope to see you there. Please, please, please let us know if you're coming because we'd love to sign your book and meet you and take pictures and do whatever you want to do.

[00:41:58] [SPEAKER_00] And this is part of Anya's plan for our big Columbus tour. Eventually, we'll go to Columbus, Georgia, Columbus, Mississippi, Columbus, Nebraska, Columbus, Wisconsin, Columbus, Kansas, Columbus, Montana. It's quite the undertaking.

[00:42:13] [SPEAKER_01] It really is. And it's not going to happen. It's that much of an undertaking.

[00:42:19] [SPEAKER_00] But I'm very excited about it. I hit the button. We've done three of these. It's time to maybe we do 15 next week.

[00:42:27] [SPEAKER_01] But I'm sure all the places of Columbus are very nice. So, goodbye. In joining our Patreon, that's available at www.patreon.com slash murdersheet. If you want to tip us a bit of money for records requests, you can do so at www.buymeacoffee.com slash murdersheet. We very much appreciate any support.

[00:42:57] [SPEAKER_00] Special thanks to Kevin Tyler Greenlee, who composed the music for The Murder Sheet, and who you can find on the web at kevintg.com.

[00:43:06] [SPEAKER_01] If you're looking to talk with other listeners about a case we've covered, you can join the Murder Sheet discussion group on Facebook. We mostly focus our time on research and reporting, so we're not on social media much. We do try to check our email account, but we ask for patience as we often receive a lot of messages. Thanks again for listening.